1963 EJ Clutch questiion

[63Ej]

Heya all,

Long time lurker, first time poster. Firstly, thanks to all the great info in this forum, been a huge help so far with my rebuild.

I bought an EJ wagon, and am busy doing up the engine. I have come to the clutch, but something just seems wrong, unless I am overthinking things.
The car came as a non-runner, so I am not sure when it was last driven etc. I have rebuilt the engine, and am about to put it in, but have hit a snag on the clutch side of things. I have put a new clutch in, but something does not seem right with the way the throwout lever moves.

The gearbox seems to be the later model one fitted to an EJ, with gear 2&3 being syncro mesh. I have put a kit through the gearbox, and everything seems good on that end. My question is to do specifically with the way the throwout lever works.
The car came without a slave cylinder, I did have an old one from a donor car, and beleive it is the correct one, as the bolt holes line up.

Picture of the slave cylinder

Slave.jpg (4.01 MiB) Viewed 195 times

With the slave cylinder inserted, below is the home position of the lever

start pos.jpg (3.36 MiB) Viewed 195 times

If I push the lever fowrard, it moves around 3mm, before the spring pops out, as it cannot move beyond the centre of the holes. Below shows the position the spring pops out

Full forward.jpg (3.89 MiB) Viewed 195 times

This slight movement from home position to max travel before the spring pops out only moves the throwout bearing around 2mm forward, which cannot be enough to engage the clutch. I am not sure what I am doing wrong, or if I have a wrong part installed from the previous owner. Looking at the manual, everything seems to be correct and present, as per the below breakdown from the manual

Clutch.jpg (4.06 MiB) Viewed 195 times

I am pretty sure this is the correct way the spring goes in, I have tried mirroring it, so the spring coils sit on the side of the bellw housing, but it does not seem to help. I feel I am either missing something very obvious, or have a wrong part installed.
Any help would be hugely appreciated, as this is stalling (excuse the pun) my project.

Please let me know if you need any clarification or more info/pictures.

Cheers,
B

[EK283]

Welcome sir to the forum.

I have never worked on one of these clutches but when you look up the description it says lever helper spring. This to me is to assist the lever moving
foward, just a thought you may have it in backwards somehow ??

Greg

[Blacky]

Welcome to the forum mate, I have just done a gearbox swap on an EK wagon, once its all together there should be about an inch of travel from the slave cylinder pushrod to the clutch fork - not sure what that translates to at the thrust bearing but I assume it should be more than that

[Errol62]

Hi and welcome 63 EJ. These are a different setup to FX to EK. They were in the crash boxes from EJ to HK. The all synchro boxes then went to mechanical style clutch actuation, with similar throw out fork setup to FX to EK. So most of us aren’t that familiar with them.

Having said this, I believe you may have an incorrect thrust bearing assembly fitted, probably the earlier type or maybe all synchro type. Comparing your photo to the diagram, the EJ one appears significantly longer. It is a stab in the dark but I hope it helps.

[In the Shed]

G’day,

I don’t have experience with your model gearbox. There is some info here where a chap was having issues with his EJ gearbox after a rebuild, perhaps some pictures / info in this thread may assist you?

Regards
Stephen

https://www.fbekholden.com/forum/viewto ... t=Ej+Vince

[63Ej]

Heya,

Thanks for the replies. The thrust bearing that came out is the same as the new one in length, and it looked to be a working clutch.
Even if it was a bit shorter, the issue seems to be in the travel the lever actually has, of only a few mm.

To me the only thing that really makes sense is either the slave cylinder is wrong, and is pushing the lever too far out (the lever sits on the housing of the slave cylinder) or somehow I have the spring setup wrong.
I am doubtful its the spring though, as it has a small clip it slides into from the front, so not too many options on orientation.
The slave cylinders I see online also look the same as the old one off the car, so unless there is some spacer I am missing, I am really at wits end.

Cheers

[63Ej]

G’day,

I don’t have experience with your model gearbox. There is some info here where a chap was having issues with his EJ gearbox after a rebuild, perhaps some pictures / info in this thread may assist you?

Regards
Stephen

https://www.fbekholden.com/forum/viewto ... t=Ej+Vince

Heya, I have read that article a few times, no mention I could see of the clutch, it was more gearbox related unfortunately

[Blacky]

This may be a stupid question, but is the clutch fork 180 degrees out ? From what I can see in the photos the lip of it goes over the bit where the spring locates in the bellhousing which cant be right - can it possibly go in the other way ? What does the clutch fork pivot on - could it be too far forward causing the interference issue ?

[63Ej]

Heya Blacky,

I do not think it can be 180 deg out, as there is a ball that the other side pivots on, that is pressed into the fork, so it can only rerally go on one way. I could somehow be overthinking the whole thing, and it will just work if I put it together, but something tells me it is wrong with only having a few mm of travel before making the spring pop out (unless there is actually something wrong with the spring)......

[EK283]

Ok Heres a set up from an Eeee Haitch.

EH1.jpg (108.93 KiB) Viewed 141 times

EH.jpg (70.81 KiB) Viewed 141 times

Looks like its right, check your throw out bearing is correct and your ball is adjusted correctly, thats all i can offer.

Greg

[63Ej]

Ok Heres a set up from an Eeee Haitch.

Looks like its right, check your throw out bearing is correct and your ball is adjusted correctly, thats all i can offer.

Greg

Thanks for the reply and pics Greg, so I assume once you put your slave cylinder in, it is also pushes the lever forward so it is sitting around about where mine is in my pic, almost inline with the back of the bush on the housing?
Can you also confirm your slave cylinder is ~30mm in length on the bit that goes into the housing.

Again, thanks, hopefully I can get the bloody engine in now!

[EK283]

It’s funny cause I was talking to a mate today and I remembered he had an EH that always had exploding gearboxes. He has a full synchro box now. He sent me the photos he had on record, Not my car so I can’t confirm the slave sorry.

Greg

[63Ej]

Thanks for the info. May just have to bite the bullet and put it back together and hope it performs

[Errol62]

Heya,

Thanks for the replies. The thrust bearing that came out is the same as the new one in length, and it looked to be a working clutch.
Even if it was a bit shorter, the issue seems to be in the travel the lever actually has, of only a few mm.

To me the only thing that really makes sense is either the slave cylinder is wrong, and is pushing the lever too far out (the lever sits on the housing of the slave cylinder) or somehow I have the spring setup wrong.
I am doubtful its the spring though, as it has a small clip it slides into from the front, so not too many options on orientation.
The slave cylinders I see online also look the same as the old one off the car, so unless there is some spacer I am missing, I am really at wits end.

Cheers

Sorry, I’m wrong about the thrust bearing. Something else but same as Greg’s mates EH, the thrust surface seems short of the driven plate splines. Maybe just the photo angle or maybe needs a lot of adjustment. Just my thoughts EJ63.

[63Ej]

The main issue i have is the position from where the lever sits on the clutch slave cylinder and where the spring pops out is about 3mm. I can't imagine that is enough travel to engage the clutch, but getting the car not running and complete I am not sure if its normal or not.

There are some transmission guys in town that seem to work on old cars, will take it to them to see if they can confirm its all good.