Hello all,
This is my first ever post as every single problem I’ve ever had has generally been solved by finding the answer here or nutting it out with my mechanic. So a big thanks to all that contribute to this forum - it’s really a great thing. Also, I’m probably not too qualified to give my two cents on other people car problems, but maybe sometime soon!
Anyway, my girl & I quit our jobs at the start of this year and are travelling around the country very slowly in our EK, doing stints of work and truly living the dream. I’d honestly recommend it to anyone.
Being from Melbourne and not having my mechanic close by anymore (we’re about an hour and a half west of bris currently), I’m on the hunt for a mechanic based in Brisbane if any of you have recommendations.
Just got some over heating issues, but really not sure if it’s my temp gauge, radiator, wiring or a combination of them all.
The problem in detail is a bit long to mention, but for all those interested:
Basically the temp gauge keeps climbing past 80 degrees if I go over 80km/h. But here is where it gets weird. When I press the brake pedal, the gauge will increase by about 10 degrees and slowly back down again when I take my foot off the brakes. Even when stationary.
Also, when I turn the car off and the temp gauge needle starts to fall, I can press the brake pedal and the needle will stop in its place until I realise the brake and it will continue to fall again.
I’ve put a new thermostat in, a recovery tank with recovery cap and flushed out the radiator which all helped slightly.
I also tested the gauge which showed it was off by about 10 degrees in boiling water then magically dropped twenty degrees after about 30 secs. I’ll replace the gauge, but my gut tells me it’s more than that.
I think it will be a case of re coring the radiator or a blockage somewhere but just want someone to have a look at it.
Sorry for the essay. Thanks for reading.
First post - early Holden mechanic in Bris?
Re: First post - early Holden mechanic in Bris?
An interesting set of symptoms . . .
Is your temperature gauge powered by the car's electrical system? This sort of "cross-talk" between different components is symptomatic of poor earthing between the engine block and the car body. Normally in EKs the braided hose to the fuel pump provides the ground connection between block and body. There's also a black wire which runs between the generator frame and one of the screws holding the regulator to the firewall.
You can check whether the brake lights have an effect by reaching under the dash and holding the brake light switch plunger in the "off" position while you push down on the pedal. If the temperature gauge doesn't change reading, then I'd suspect poor grounds between block and body.
To the overheating problem then -
Grey motors are only supposed to have a 70-degree thermostat. If you are concerned about the car running too hot, take the thermostat out. As long as the coolant temperature gets to about 70 degrees, you are not going to affect engine life by running without a thermostat.
Does the car boil over and lose coolant on long drives? The boiling point with a 7-lb radiator cap is around 110 degrees C. This is the danger level, but it doesn't sound like the engine's getting that hot.
As a sanity check, I'd suggest you disconnect the overflow hose from the recovery tank, put the open end in a soft drink bottle, drain the radiator until the water level is an inch below the filler neck, and drive the car for an hour or so at highway speed. Then check to see what's inside the soft drink bottle. If no coolant has come out, you have no problem.
Rob
Is your temperature gauge powered by the car's electrical system? This sort of "cross-talk" between different components is symptomatic of poor earthing between the engine block and the car body. Normally in EKs the braided hose to the fuel pump provides the ground connection between block and body. There's also a black wire which runs between the generator frame and one of the screws holding the regulator to the firewall.
You can check whether the brake lights have an effect by reaching under the dash and holding the brake light switch plunger in the "off" position while you push down on the pedal. If the temperature gauge doesn't change reading, then I'd suspect poor grounds between block and body.
To the overheating problem then -
Grey motors are only supposed to have a 70-degree thermostat. If you are concerned about the car running too hot, take the thermostat out. As long as the coolant temperature gets to about 70 degrees, you are not going to affect engine life by running without a thermostat.
Does the car boil over and lose coolant on long drives? The boiling point with a 7-lb radiator cap is around 110 degrees C. This is the danger level, but it doesn't sound like the engine's getting that hot.
As a sanity check, I'd suggest you disconnect the overflow hose from the recovery tank, put the open end in a soft drink bottle, drain the radiator until the water level is an inch below the filler neck, and drive the car for an hour or so at highway speed. Then check to see what's inside the soft drink bottle. If no coolant has come out, you have no problem.
Rob
Re: First post - early Holden mechanic in Bris?
Welcome to the forum mate, a simple check would be grab a cheap temperature gun and check the temperature of the engine and compare it to the guage , Robs idea sounds like a bloody good one though.
I started with nothing and still have most of it left.
Foundation member #61 of FB/EK Holden club of W.A.
Foundation member #61 of FB/EK Holden club of W.A.
Re: First post - early Holden mechanic in Bris?
Thanks gents,
I will have a crack at this and let you know how I go.
Rob, it did boil over once before I changed to a recovery system. And since then I haven’t really taken it over 80km/h.
Anyway, will be back in touch with the results.
Thanks again
Ryan
I will have a crack at this and let you know how I go.
Rob, it did boil over once before I changed to a recovery system. And since then I haven’t really taken it over 80km/h.
Anyway, will be back in touch with the results.
Thanks again
Ryan
Re: First post - early Holden mechanic in Bris?
I’ll echo Blackys sentiments, get a heat gun and check temps.
I will add I’d strongly recommend not running without a thermostat. It’s there to slow the flow of water through the radiator and maintain a more constant temp. Once your car heats up especially at freeway speeds the water is flowing much faster and will spend less time being cooled if it’s flowing to quickly. I’ve seen running higher temp thermostats actually make a car run cooler. I’ve been down the overheating car many moons ago and its not fun. Learnt a lot from a very good but now gone radiator repairer.
But from what you’ve said I’d be leaning more towards an electrics sense more than overheating.
I will add I’d strongly recommend not running without a thermostat. It’s there to slow the flow of water through the radiator and maintain a more constant temp. Once your car heats up especially at freeway speeds the water is flowing much faster and will spend less time being cooled if it’s flowing to quickly. I’ve seen running higher temp thermostats actually make a car run cooler. I’ve been down the overheating car many moons ago and its not fun. Learnt a lot from a very good but now gone radiator repairer.
But from what you’ve said I’d be leaning more towards an electrics sense more than overheating.
Speed and Style........... One day I'll get the speed bit.
Re: First post - early Holden mechanic in Bris?
Ok so months later I think I’m close to solving this problem. There was indeed an earthing problem which fixed the temp gauge rising up and down erratically.
But before this was solved I took the car to a mechanic to check if the engine was overheating and he ended up putting in a 81c thermostat(with out asking me) saying the coolant will have more time to cool when driving long distance which is what I am doing. So low and behold after the earthing problem was fixed I found the car running just under 90c rather than 80 which is where I would prefer it to be. Im going to change back to a 71c thermostat and I feel all will be back to normal again.
I have a temp gun but really can’t get any decent readings when pointing it at the engine. Where’s the best place to get a reading? Near the temp gauge sender? I find the temp varies a lot when pointed to different parts of the head/block.
But before this was solved I took the car to a mechanic to check if the engine was overheating and he ended up putting in a 81c thermostat(with out asking me) saying the coolant will have more time to cool when driving long distance which is what I am doing. So low and behold after the earthing problem was fixed I found the car running just under 90c rather than 80 which is where I would prefer it to be. Im going to change back to a 71c thermostat and I feel all will be back to normal again.
I have a temp gun but really can’t get any decent readings when pointing it at the engine. Where’s the best place to get a reading? Near the temp gauge sender? I find the temp varies a lot when pointed to different parts of the head/block.
Re: First post - early Holden mechanic in Bris?
Temps of just under 90 are pretty well spot on , if anything maybe a little low - running an engine too cold is just as bad as running it too hot - should be in the low to mid nineties , later model engines temperatures in the high nineties is common.
The temp probe most useful function is to check the difference in temperature between top and bottom radiator hoses.
The temp probe most useful function is to check the difference in temperature between top and bottom radiator hoses.
I started with nothing and still have most of it left.
Foundation member #61 of FB/EK Holden club of W.A.
Foundation member #61 of FB/EK Holden club of W.A.
Re: First post - early Holden mechanic in Bris?
Thanks Blacky,
I was under the impression the greys like running around 80c. I’ve tried to find the operating temp in my Gregory’s but to no avail. I’ll just roll with this thermostat then.
Seems funny that my engine has been running colder than usual with the recommended thermostat though…..
I was under the impression the greys like running around 80c. I’ve tried to find the operating temp in my Gregory’s but to no avail. I’ll just roll with this thermostat then.
Seems funny that my engine has been running colder than usual with the recommended thermostat though…..
Re: First post - early Holden mechanic in Bris?
Grey motors don't, in general, like running too hot. FXs and FJs had a 160F (71 C) thermostat, and a 4 lb radiator cap. Later on, a 7 lb radiator cap was fitted, but I think the thermostat was always a 160F. With early Holdens, the radiator is the limiting factor in getting the heat out. One of my cars has an original GM-H radiator core, and the coolant temperature is about 60 C above ambient. I do not have a thermostat fitted, for obvious reasons.
The "more time to cool" idea is a furphy. Sorry. All that happens is that your peak coolant temperature is raised with a hotter thermostat. Slower flow, greater temperature difference; faster flow, lesser temperature difference; same thermal dissipation.
You'll get widely differing temperature readings pointing the temperature gun at different parts of the engine. The hottest place is the rear of the cylinder head. But don't aim the gun at the exhaust manifold . . .
Rob
The "more time to cool" idea is a furphy. Sorry. All that happens is that your peak coolant temperature is raised with a hotter thermostat. Slower flow, greater temperature difference; faster flow, lesser temperature difference; same thermal dissipation.
You'll get widely differing temperature readings pointing the temperature gun at different parts of the engine. The hottest place is the rear of the cylinder head. But don't aim the gun at the exhaust manifold . . .
Rob
Re: First post - early Holden mechanic in Bris?
Cheers rob.
Yes I feel we could go on and on about running temp of a grey. And I agree that thermostat has just raised the operating temperature. I was told to keep it around 80 degrees from my then mechanic and that’s where the gauge has sat for 15 years and I have had very few problems. But if 90 degrees is a better running temp as Blacky pointed out, then maybe I should stick to this thermostat (81 degrees) instead of the recommended 71 degree thermostat.
In terms of using the temp gun. My opinion is the top of the radiator and the hoses are the best spots. Forget pointing near the sender or anywhere shiny & metallic. Temp guns are more accurate on dark matt surfaces. Here’s what I got:
Approx readings:
Temp gauge - 90
Bottom hose - 60
Top hose - 70
Top of radiator - 80
Cheers for your opinion,
Ryan
Yes I feel we could go on and on about running temp of a grey. And I agree that thermostat has just raised the operating temperature. I was told to keep it around 80 degrees from my then mechanic and that’s where the gauge has sat for 15 years and I have had very few problems. But if 90 degrees is a better running temp as Blacky pointed out, then maybe I should stick to this thermostat (81 degrees) instead of the recommended 71 degree thermostat.
In terms of using the temp gun. My opinion is the top of the radiator and the hoses are the best spots. Forget pointing near the sender or anywhere shiny & metallic. Temp guns are more accurate on dark matt surfaces. Here’s what I got:
Approx readings:
Temp gauge - 90
Bottom hose - 60
Top hose - 70
Top of radiator - 80
Cheers for your opinion,
Ryan
Re: First post - early Holden mechanic in Bris?
the key to getting a grey motor to run cool is on the back of a tilt tray.
or you can do what nasco did and open up the rear water gallery.
or you can do what nasco did and open up the rear water gallery.
