Neils Frankenstein Ute

[FireKraka]

Here's one for the Brains Trust that I hope you can assist me with
I had Frank back to the Dyno 2 weeks ago to see if I could find the missing ponies that the engine is supposed to have.
The time before the Dyno guy (I'm using the standard remapped Delco ECU) keep telling me there was something wrong with the engine and he wouldn't put more timing/fuel into it as the exhaust temps were all over the place, he said I had low compression and because of the cam he said maybe I had the wrong push rods in the engine!!
I know that it has the correct Crow Cam push rods as I have had them out and they are the same as indicated in the build sheet I have for the engine when it was originally built. What I did find that time was that the first shop I had Frank in had put 2 new spark plugs in #1 & 2 cylinders and the rest were old and carboned up from when I was running it with a bad tune, I put a new set of plugs and got even exhaust temps on all 6.
So !! while I had the plugs out I did a full compression test and got 150psi on all cylinders.
Again SO we go back to the Dyno the second time and the guy plays a little with timing and fuel (It was running really rich) and we lose horse power
So I go home stewing on this for a few days, the engine feels fairly strong and is driving not too bad right so I send the guy a message and just ask the question how can we lose horse power from one Dyno to the next and ask is he sure his Dyno is in calibration and not faulty, he does not answer why we lost horse power he just states "I've told you no compression no horse power"
So referring to build stuff on the engine it tells me the engine is supposed to be 10:1 compression now in my uneducated world 10:1 compression equates to PSI by the equation 10 x atmospheric (the 1) which is 14.7 (we'll say 15 PSI) this should be 150psi I assume.
So my question to you all is am I missing something here or do I have an issue with the engine and the compression should be much higher is it is supposed to be 10:1
Look forward to any comments and help.
Regards
Neil

[gpi]

do a leak down test and report back again

[Errol62]

As you know dynamic compression will vary with cam spec Neil, assuming valves are sealing well. My experience is with stock straight six with stated static comp around 8.5:1. Good condition blue 202, mild cam, consistent 175-180psi. Same gauge, tired 186, stock cam, 155-175psi. What is your static comp and cam specs? Maybe you do need more compression.

FB ute driver, EK van project

[EK283]

I keep wondering what the supposed horsepower that the engine is supposed to have ???
The compression has to match the fuel you are using, the cam and head flow also plays into the equation ! I have a race engine and the calculated compression is 10 to 1, its a small V8 and has 300 rear wheel HP. I mixed and matched head gaskets for more compression and no change. I then changed the manifold and carby and increased the power by 50 horses !
Personally the quoted figures by a guy selling you an engine are rubbish, the dyno and a good tune with the gear you have will tell the truth !
Regards Greg

[Harv]

10:1 compression will give all kinds of static pressure (with a pressure gauge) depending on valve overlap.

Lumpy cam, lots of overlap, and the inlet and ‘zorst valves are open at the same time, for a long time. Static compression gets robbed, but when the thing is screaming at 8000rpm you get decent squeeze. The dyno guy should know this.

A leak down test will tell you if the valves are leaking, but is a lot more fiddly than a normal compression test. Can loan you the test gear if you need it.

Cheers,
Harv

[Blacky]

mate have you had a chat with Justin at BYE ???? He is the guru on V6 donks

[FireKraka]

Thanks guys lots to think about, I just ordered a leak down tester from eBay only $40 so will wait until that gets here and do that.
I have a feeling that Frank is going to have heart surgery if I can't solve the problem with the engine in.
Greg I have the dyno chart for the engine when it was in the guys car and it was 227HP engine still had honing marks in the cylinders when I removed the heads to check everything, I had to change the valves springs before it went into the car and I didn't want to remove the heads again so made up a tool to go into the spark plug hole so I could pressurize the cylinder to check the valves shut while I changed the springs, when I put air onto each cylinder they went straight to bottom dead center and valves stayed shut however I suppose it would really show me anything as I did have air on it all the time. I do believe it was showing that the rings were sealing
Blacky who is BYE I googled and nothing came up that makes any sense.
Thanks again for the responses guys I'll come back when I know more.
Neil

[FireKraka]

Received my new sway bars last week from Signature Sway Bars in Wollongong (Selby) they looked great and came with all the mounting gear.

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Front one went in ok with a little pulling and pushing.

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Unfortunately looks like I'm not going to be able to fit the rear bar, the commodore fuel tank is too wide if I try to face it to the rear and my muffler is in the way if I try to face it forward will have to ponder what to do
Also played around a little and fitted a new gear knob on the B&M Shifter

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It never ends!!!!!!!!
Haven't done the leakdown test on the engine yet been a little time poor.
Neil

[Errol62]

Neil,
I have one of those rear bars, but ended up fitting XK-XC Falcon bar per advice from Greg EK283. The one you have has quite long arms, which i believe are intended to mount to brackets located via the spring front bolts. Ideally, I think you would fabricate the exhaust after installing the rear bar, but these things don't always work out and I dare say you have spent a bit on a nice system. The bar I fitted is going to require exhaust mods as well due to position of the left hand body mount. Luckily I haven't splashed any cash on the exhaust yet. I will probably cut mine at the centre mount and stick it out the side for the time being.

Another thing about the long arms, obviously won't be as stiff as the shorter arms for the same diameter bar. If I find my setup too stiff i may try the other bar, or save it for the van. It was originally intended for an EH.
Cheers,
Clay

[basic.green]

hi mate just looking at the pic of shifter and just wondering what speedo do you have ??

[FireKraka]

Hi Basic;
Mate the speedo and all of the gauges are from Speed Hut in the good ol US of A it is a GPS speedo have a look at their website they have a lot of styles and can customize not cheap but works and looks really good.
They are very thin so plenty of room behind.
Neil

[basic.green]

cheers for the heads up..lot cheaper than auto meter cheers

[FireKraka]

So I've put Frank on to the new WA concessional rego rego went from over $700 to just over $150 which is great the down side is we have to run the sidn in the photo below, ugly but if you don't have it and get caught of course they will fine you, only have have one so I put it on the back

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[Errol62]

For an instant Neil, thought you were going to say put Frank on the train east.

Good value. I’ve been driving mine so much lately I keep forgetting to fill out the logbook. Serious consequences if caught, and can be retrospective if snapped on numberplate recognition too.


FB ute fixer upper, EK van on rotisserie

[FireKraka]

Well I haven't had Frank back on the dyno and don't really think I will bother, it is running well now and strong enough for a good driver.
I did find a couple of things that I believe have made a difference
1st The engine is basically a series one and I had put the alloy rocker covers on, the series 1 engines used to vent the crankcase pressure back to the throttle body from the passenger side rocker cover and when I change the covers I had not connected a crankcase breather rectified that.
2nd before I got things going not too bad the engine had been running ridiculously hot so I had removed the thermostat, after it had been on the Dyno and tuned better the engine was running really really cold, I reinstalled the thermostat and no runs nicely at just over 90, I remember Blacky saying that running that cold the engine couldn't expand and I suspect that part of the lack of power of this.
3rd I never really liked the way I had made the accelerator, it was too long and I found it uncomfortable driving for a period with my leg bent like that, sooo I'm mucking around a couple of weeks ago, I had the bonnet open and was standing so I could push the accelerator while looking at the top of the throttle body and low and behold with the pedal on the floor the butterfly wasn't going fully open I pulled the whole accelerator shortened it and bent it to make sure that it now fully opens the throttle body butterfly
So after all that guess what Maybe I am imagining it but Frank seems to pull harder when stick my boot into it now.

On the cosmetic side, you don't realize how close the back window is to you, when we had been out cruising the heat that comes through the back window was pretty intense so I bought an after market venetian and fitted it last weekend, I thought the quality was not bad, material is metal and fairly well built, funny thing is it doesn't mount by tabs that you slip into the rubbers like other ones I have seen but you have to drill holes in the window dividers and use screws.
Anyway it looks ok and will do the job.

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Regards
Neil