Towing

[rosco]

Hi all,

BE WARNED - this post is Tolstoy's "WAR and PEACE"... but for anyone in the same predicament seeking a caravan - you may read some very important information in it - I have put a lot of research into this and it may prove your reading worthwhile......

For the record - most states/territories that I have had replies from - state that our old jalopies are restricted to 1.5 times the vehicle weight - which is around the old 22 cwt - just over a ton....... someone enlighten us as to what this is in kilonanos or whatever...... however - pertaining to caravans - and loaded trailers - if the weight of the towed vehicle exceeds 750 kg's it must be equipped with brakes - exceeding 2 tonnes must have all wheels braked - that is probably not relevant to FB/EK's....

This is a direct copy of a thread I have just thrown up on the "newhilux" site....

It's long - and there is no withdrawl...... at your peril......

frats,
Rosco



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Towing - ATM weight restrictions

Postby rosco01 on Wed, 26 Aug 2009 6:02 +0000
Ok - this is almost the result of a week's research concerning what many may fall victim of in regards to towing legally with our Hiluxes.........

We are in the throes of purchasing a caravan for our retirement - and have found one which suits us almost to a tee...... except - this little three lettereed abbreviation (surprised it hasn't attracted acronym status) called ATM........ read on and take note!

In our research for a van, we have come across some pretty unscrupulous "stealers" who would have us purchase a van from them by pointing out the Tare weight of the van....... "you can tow 2250 with your Hilux - this van is only 2200 kg - that's under you limit..... ".... but, dear readers - read on!

The FIGURE you should concern yourselves with is the ATM , or Aggregate Trailer Mass - this must be labeled on the compliance/manufacturer's plate and states the maximum permissible weight of the van - including the weight it imposes on the tow ball........

We were within a bees - appendage of signing up...... and backed off, mainly due to "spur of the moment or impulse" purchase...... the figure we were offered was $52,000 on the road.... it was very tempting for a van retailing at $54,995 plus on roads and duty which would have taken it well into the $57's......... I like 10% - always have, always will.... so if you want to sell me something - jack your price by 10% and you may get my attention with the "discount".......

As it eventuated, we joined a number of RV forums and the REAL truth soon emerged....... a t m, atm, Atm, ATM .......

I was informed that I could not "legally" couple to a van with a higher ATM than my vehicle was rated at - even if I had not loaded the van to my "weight".......

I got very disappointed and concerned over the next few weeks looking at vans - just about every tandem van we came across with combined toilet/shower (sort of domestically .... um (use diplomacy here, Rosco)...... needed) revealed an ATM in excess of our limit..... but just..... I was seriously beginning to believe we had made a mistake purchasing our little truck...... the Prado - for some reason or other is afforded 2500 kg's and this now appeared to "BE" the vehicle for the van we desired........ read on.... it gets better.......

I decided to write away to each state/territory seeking clarification and official stance on this big ATM issue..... of the Six I have written to - three have replied already.......

1/- NSW (first pigeon back in the loft)........

"Ross,

You can tow up to the manufactures limit of the motor vehicle,you cannot exceed this at any time.

The caravan may have a higher ATM than what your vehicle can tow,but this is okay,it simply means that you are restricted to the lesser weight of the vehicle tow limit.

Regards

RTA Tech Enq"


...... one down, five to go.....

2/- NT (second pigeon) - almost the exact words of NSW....... but a bit more info

Gday Ross/Dorothy

Thankyou for your email inquiry yesterday regarding Aggregate Trailer Mass (ATM) requirements with regard to the towing vehicle in the NT.

Under the Motor Vehicles (Standards) Regulations, if a motor vehicle with a Gross Vehicle Mass not exceeding 4.5 tonnes is towing a trailer, the laden mass of the trailer is not to exceed –
(a) the towing capacity of the motor vehicle; or
(b) the towing capacity of the towing apparatus fitted to the vehicle,
whichever is the lesser.

So, in a nutshell, you can tow a caravan that has a potential ATM that is greater than the towing capacity of your vehicle, providing you do not exceed the towing capacity of your vehicle (i.e. you may not be able to carry the full potential payload in the caravan). The offence is exceeding the towing capacity of the vehicle or towing apparatus.

It is also important to note and not exceed the “tow ball weight” specifications, the GVM of the towing vehicle, and the Gross Combination Mass (GCM) of the vehicle and caravan together.


Separately, with relation to your final request regarding information on towing caravans in the NT, I have included a link to the Department’s Road Safety website (below) which has some good information and general tips for driving in the NT;
http://www.nt.gov.au/transport/safety/r ... ndex.shtml


two down - four to go.....

3/- Qld - (this pigeon came back with Joh all over it).......

and is a DIRECT copy and paste from the email I received today.....

"In response to your questions specifically:

While there is no specific law saying that a vehicle can not tow a trailer
with an ATM in excess of the vehicles towing capacity, it is reasonable (and
does currently occur regularly) that by having an ATM in excess of a vehicles
tow capacity gives the ability to exceed the vehicles towing capacity. This
can result in the vehicle being stopped and prevented from moving until the
operator can prove that they are not overloaded.
(Basically every time you went on a journey you would need to put the trailer
over a weighbridge to ensure you could justify the weight)

I hope this information clears up this gray area for you. If you have any
further questions that you would like answered, please feel free to contact me
directly on the number below and I will be happy to provide you as much
information as I can.

Grey area - not at all........ it's downright "fogged"...........and straight from "10 mile"........

Still waiting for pigeons from Vic (my own state), WA, SA to arrive..... it's been pretty windy down here - perhaps Oz post has not cranked up the "fairly beacons" enough........

The second consderation is Tow Ball Mass - in general terms, it is 10% of the vehicle's towing capacity..... for ours, you will find it is 225 kg's...... (10% of our legal limit) - this is obtained by unhitching and placing scales under the hitch coupling......

It has also been stated in all states/territories so far that if a trailer exceeds 750 kg's - it must be fitted with brakes.
Up to a weight of 2 tonnes an over-riding brake can be used. 2 tonnes and above - it must have 4 wheel brakes and must have an electric break-away brake system fitted which will hold the vehicle for 15 minutes

BE VERY,VERY, VERY CAREFUL readers if you entertain the thought of a 5th wheeler - very affordable imports from USA can be obtained.....do your sums and make absolutely certain that they will conform to Australian standards........
Make absolutely sure that they do not exceed 4.5 tonnes - you will NEED AIR BRAKES..... and the dimensions afforded to our US motorists - are beyond what is legal here - especially in width/height........ be, very, very careful..... fortunately, the weight issue will most likely prevent Hiluxes from legally being allowed to couple..... but if you have friends/relatives etc....... with other vehicles...... make sure they are aware of the implications of a 5th wheeler.......

..... there's more.... but I'm still waiting for replies to marry any state/territory "aligned" info .........

If you are interested in more on this - before I update this thread with the dispatches from remaining pigeons.....
at your bookstore, newsagent - Coles even - have a flick through the (timely, I must say) September edition of Caravan World.... there is also a write-up on the Navarra with it's 400 plus nM of non intercooled turbo diesel torque - the tow limit rated at 3 tonnes... and a snippet on the BT 50.. also at 3 tonnes......

Guess, if we get this van - Qld is going to have to draw on others to furnish their RV tourism income - we're OK for NT and NSW.... just need a way to get there...... come on SA..... we're depending on you.......and would love to travel WA in our "rig".......

how's your "reading" eyes..... I have a bad habit of writing "novels"..... as other forums will substantiate......

frats,
Rosco

[Sammy]

theres too many terms and finer details on this sorta stuff these days!

its good to see your on top of it though, be nothing worth than getting shafted with what you can tow after you've spent the dollars!

[Devilrod]

Novels or not Rosco there is some really good info there. Certainly a bit of helpful info for those looking to buy for sure.

[hammondo]

This is interesting for me rosco as I tow a lot of trailers, Is ATM a new version of GVM for trailers?

Also,I have always wondered if I can tow my electric braked trailer with a car that doesn't have the controller if the trailer is empty (and therefor under 750kg)? I have always assumed that is ok.

Greg.

[rosco]

Hi greg,
I'm not thoroughly convinced I have enough on this to profess what has changed - my understanding of ATM at present is Aggregate Trailer Mass - a weight which the trailer (and it's loading) cannot exceed - Gross Vehicle Mass to me - would appear the same ..... don't quote me - I'm sure there is a reason for the name change .......

In answer to your electric brake question - I would probably suggest you contact your State authority - as the response from Qld above indicates - it would appear that "guessing" is not to be accepted.....

My answer - because you have asked for it..... and I am in no way qualified to offer any advice -
.......because your trailer mass is below the 750 kg's - I would understand this to mean it does not require brakes....
........however - because the vehicle is actually fitted with them and they are inoperative ..... I think you can see the paradox.......

I have had an interesting reply from the National authority on my post above.... at this point in time, it would appear that there is also "friction" between the "national" and "state" authorities on this...... my short answer.... you are more likely to be pulled up by a state "officer" than a federal one........

I will know more shortly concerning what is legal in regards to a higher ATM than the tow vehicle is certified for..... still waiting for "pigeons" to come home to roost........

frats,
Rosco