FB Standard Wagon

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FbSTDwagon
Posts: 777
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:04 am
State: SA

Re: FB Standard Wagon

Post by FbSTDwagon »

Found the culprit.

Cheap fuel regulator must have packed its internals in, removed it and filled the gap with some hose.

I got warned they don’t last long, it didn’t even get out my driveway.

Commodore fuel pump puts out 4psi so I’ll have to keep an eye on it to see if it causes carby issues.

But running sweet again!
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Drew
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funkyscooter
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Re: FB Standard Wagon

Post by funkyscooter »

From memory you turn the dial on one of those to see how large an engine bay fire you need. :wtf:

I have one of the same type on the triple SU set up that I had on my sedan and it was fine for 4 years.
So I put one on my Karmann Ghia when I put a low pressure electric pump and duel webbers on it. Lasted a week. Lucky I was working on the car when the leaking started.
Replaced it with a Holley Fuel Pressure Reg (1-4 PSI) and a fuel pressure gauge. Been good since.
Scott
(Not so rusty) Ol' Rusty - FB/EK Sedan
FbSTDwagon
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Re: FB Standard Wagon

Post by FbSTDwagon »

I definitely wish I bought a Holley unit now!

Oh well poor man pays twice they say.
Drew
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Errol62
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Re: FB Standard Wagon

Post by Errol62 »

I still reckon the original EK fuel pumps put out the same pressure as the later ones. The governing factor of fuel pressure in these pumps is the diaphragm return spring in the bottom half of the pump. The bell crank running off the cam lobe compresses the spring a defined amount at a rate according to RPM, but the diaphragm pull rod has a long slot which allows it to float between spring pressure and back pressure caused by the needle and seat valve. If you are concerned about excess pressure you could fit an earlier spring, assuming it will be softer, which I doubt.

VK commodore runs the identical needle and seat, and float arrangement in the Varajet carb is also similar. Fuel use at idle would be little different between the grey and black engines, and no they didn’t have a regulator. In other words ditch the piece of junk and KISS.


FB ute fixer upper, EK van on rotisserie
getting my FB ute on the road
EK van on rotisserie
FbSTDwagon
Posts: 777
Joined: Thu Jul 02, 2020 3:04 am
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Re: FB Standard Wagon

Post by FbSTDwagon »

No worries Clay that all makes sense so I’ll just leave the pump as it is.

I was only concerned as I’ve hat people warn me that the later ‘Non glass bowl’ pumps push too mush due through and can hold the needles open causing flooding and making the carbies weep.

I did contact Goss and from memory they said they make 4psi but the glass ones makes 2.5psi
Drew
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Harv
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Re: FB Standard Wagon

Post by Harv »

I reckon you will be fine running Strombergs with the later non-glass pump and no pressure reg. GMH ran that same needle and seat the same way (until the BX carbs died out in the 80's) without flooding.

Strommies are happy at 2.5-4.5psi. A Holley is a little more tolerant (up to 7psi), whilst SUs are a little more fussy (1.5-3.5 and overflow at 5psi).

Cheers,
Harv
327 Chev EK wagon, original EK ute for Number 1 Daughter, an FB sedan meth monster project and a BB/MD grey motored FED.
FbSTDwagon
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Re: FB Standard Wagon

Post by FbSTDwagon »

Harv wrote: Wed Jan 18, 2023 8:22 am I reckon you will be fine running Strombergs with the later non-glass pump and no pressure reg. GMH ran that same needle and seat the same way (until the BX carbs died out in the 80's) without flooding.

Strommies are happy at 2.5-4.5psi. A Holley is a little more tolerant (up to 7psi), whilst SUs are a little more fussy (1.5-3.5 and overflow at 5psi).

Cheers,
Harv
Awsome that’s good to know.

Just annoyed now I have rubber hose right in middle of my nicely shaped fuel pipe between the pump and the carbs.

Another 1% job for the Muppet later on.
Drew
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Harv
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Re: FB Standard Wagon

Post by Harv »

You could put a filter there if you don't already have one.

Cheers,
Harv
327 Chev EK wagon, original EK ute for Number 1 Daughter, an FB sedan meth monster project and a BB/MD grey motored FED.
FbSTDwagon
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Re: FB Standard Wagon

Post by FbSTDwagon »

I’ve got the filter before the pump buts it’s horizontal and looks to only be filled to half level all the time.

A vertical position may be a better option
Drew
FbSTDwagon
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Re: FB Standard Wagon

Post by FbSTDwagon »

Well the old boy is all wired up now, although I didn’t actually take photos of the wiring lol.

Will post some of them when I go and pick it up.

All went fairly smoothly except for the fuel guage…
Due to the mustang tank sender the Holden guage is reading full which is incorrect.

Pulled the sender out of the tank and measured the resistance

78 ohms empty
8 ohms full

I have not ever measured a FB fuel sender for resistance.

Has anyone got a fix to get the new sender to work accurately on my FB guage?

Auto sparky said to add a resistor in the sender line but he doesn’t actually know what size resistor and if it will even work.

Any suggestions?
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Drew
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ehsv6
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Re: FB Standard Wagon

Post by ehsv6 »

Member EH Holden Car Club Vic
Supercharged V6 EH Sedan
EH Wagon
ardiesse
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Re: FB Standard Wagon

Post by ardiesse »

The Holden sender is a 30-ohm variable resistance. Disconnect the sender wire at the tank and turn the ignition on. The gauge should read full-scale; and if you connect the sender wire to ground the gauge should read empty. If this is what happens, then the Holden sender is zero ohms at empty and 30 ohms at full.

The Mustang sender has low resistance at full and high resistance at empty. So it's the wrong way around, as well as being the wrong value. Adding resistance either in series or parallel won't fix the problem. From here it just gets tricky. Do you put a &*#@ movement in the Holden fuel gauge? Do you modify the Mustang sender to take the Holden resistance?

Rob
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Re: FB Standard Wagon

Post by Blacky »

ehsv6 wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 12:11 pm This may suit

https://www.madfolk.com.au/fuel-gauge-m ... 3nNwEtpyMY
I’m liking that unit , I have a VE Commode fuel pump/ sender in the rattler and was wondering if I can adapt the later model sender 👍 might look into one of these myself
When you're faced with an unpleasant task that you really don't want to do, sometimes you just have to dig deep down inside and somehow find the patience to wait for someone else to do it for you.


Foundation member #61 of FB/EK Holden club of W.A.
FbSTDwagon
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Re: FB Standard Wagon

Post by FbSTDwagon »

Thanks guys for the information.

The fuel gauge interface looks like it will work but I’ll get the opinion of the auto sparky.

Cheers Rob for the resistance values. Yes I will check how the gauge behaves wit the tests that you suggested.

And yes I also would be be surprised if we have the resistance readings ars about face too, so I’ll need to double check it all.

I might contact the guys I bought the tank off and see if there are options when it comes to buying senders.
With some luck they will have a 0-30 ohm sender.

Thanks again
Drew
EK283
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Re: FB Standard Wagon

Post by EK283 »

FbSTDwagon wrote: Tue Jan 31, 2023 5:40 am Thanks guys for the information.

The fuel gauge interface looks like it will work but I’ll get the opinion of the auto sparky.

Cheers Rob for the resistance values. Yes I will check how the gauge behaves wit the tests that you suggested.

And yes I also would be be surprised if we have the resistance readings ars about face too, so I’ll need to double check it all.

I might contact the guys I bought the tank off and see if there are options when it comes to buying senders.
With some luck they will have a 0-30 ohm sender.

Thanks again
I went through this as well with the Fraud XB tank. Your sender reading for Mustang is correct and works 75 ohms empty 10 ohms full, so it is back to front to an EK.
The way around it is to change the gauge to a &*#@ one, fidly but can be done to fit into the original Fb Ek housing.
To get the original gauge rewound to suite the new sender to me was filthy expensive, and because I needed more things like oil pressure tacho etc, I ended up with new gauges and my problem was solved that way.

Regards Greg
Last edited by EK283 on Tue Jan 31, 2023 6:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
So many cars so little time!
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