Unleaded conversion including drive train

[Coopa]

Hi all,
Im very early into my EK sedan resto and am at the stage of deciding to weather to restore the 138 Grey 3 Speed or convert the old girl to a unleaded engine, so I thought I would ask to guys who have been there and done that.

If I dont leave the Grey in her I was thinking either Black 202 Engine or VR V6 engine and drive train.

Could you's provide your thoughts on the two options and any info on the options ie "VR diff is a pain in the A?!e to use so use a ....... diff" what is best and what is the eaisest setup to modify to fit, budget wise not to fussed if it cost more then Ill just build it over a longer period and I will complete all the mod's my self, Im a welder (well used to be one lol) and I work for a large engineering company.

Any feed back would be greatly appreciated.

[Mick]

you'll get this answer more than once it all comes down to personal preferance, what you want

[Coopa]

Hi Mick,
I prefer the look of the straight six, how ever the V6 would be eaiser to procure by purchasing a complete car, so I guess the V6 would be the preference from a procurement point.

So I guess the question should be whats involved in converting the VR diff and is the VR the best option donor car or is there a better model Commodore to use?

[Rusty EK]

Another thing you will have to allow for if changing engines is getting an engineer involved, this will add to your expense.

Also all the extra bits that go along with it , they will make you fit seatbelts , 2- speed wipers and washers , upgrade brakes , etc ,etc , all not bad things to do if you are going to use it frequently , but will add to your cost .

[Harv]

Hmmm... V6 or straight 6? Similar amounts of engineering grief regardless of which way you go... and a lot more grief than overhauling the grey.

I guess it depends on how much grunt you want, what you want to do yourself, and what you know.

The straight 6 has less grunt potential (though can be a beast in the right hands IMHO), and there are more "almost off the shelf" options to make the V6 sing. The straight 6 though is mechanically simpler (eg EFI etc) if you do it yourself. There is (sadly) probably more support around (mechanics etc) that understand the V6 than the straight 6 if you are not doing the work, including ongoing maintenence, yourself.

Think through the whole drivetrain before choosing a diff, gearbox etc. Things like matching wheel pattern to the front of the car, though not insurmountable, can make you choose different options (...try fitting 15" Commodore wheels to a Hadfield HR front end ).

Mick and Rusty are right though - most of the choices come down to personal preference and what (your) engineer will let you get away with.

Cheers,
Harv

[Coopa]

Thanks for the reponces guys.

I have spoken to Castlemaine Rod Shop they tell me that they can match there front end to Commodore disc's & brakes etc, I guess the main thought was if I go the V6 I could purchase a complete commy as a donor car and have the advantages of the new tech with the body having the class of the old school, if a VR is the right choice?

My father is a x GM Motors mechanic and Ive dabbled a bit haha, so im not to worried about the engine side of things as I like both enigine options and do plan already to install side intrusion bars, seat belts etc chassis kit etc it's more the rest of the drive line package mainly around diff fitment which option is the best for the conversion as I would prefer to try and have a drive line complete from one type of vehicle.

I guess im just after the best advise i can get bofore I get to far in to the build and repair things that dont need to be repaired etc and to submit my form to transport for pre approval then the discussion with the engineer. Not to worried about costs (without being to silly) as I would rather spend extra time building her and have it done right as once completed and tested for a while she will be my daily ride.

I hope that makes sence?

Cheers Coop's

[Trev]

For ease of rear end fitting and matching the front stud pattern the HR disc front and rear ends would be best.
Just for the fact that you don't need to shorten a VR rear end to get the Commodore stud pattern front and rear.
Which means the straight 6 (whether fuel injected black motor or a carbied red) is very simple to fit.

Although if you use a Pat Gardener kit to fit the V6 it will also be pretty easy but more expensive.

Just my thoughts .

[Coopa]

Thanks Trev,
Does the HR diff fit without mods?

Cheers Coops

[Mick]

red motor is a simple swap V6 is alot more complicated i'de rather stick a V8 than a V6 through ease, for the V6 things like a sump/oil pickup have to be fabricated although they can be purchased through CRS or gardeners etc
if you can weld/fabricate yor laughing you don't really need any of those guys unless you want to take the easy way as for diff there's been a couple tackled on here so no biggy
why VR V6 why not go VS V6 about the same to purchase donor and you get echotech engine or go backwards, i've read that the quickest of the V6's was in the early VNs the manual version was only fractions of a second slower over the 1/4 than a V8 SS, i've had a few VN, VP, VR commodores and by far the quickest was an early VN V6 manual

and as per yor diff question above EJ,EH,HD,HR diff drum to drum diff are bolt in and worth putting in

[Harv]

Coops,

The Castekmaine Rod Shop front end adaptors will let you run Commodore front wheels on a HR front end - this is what I have on my EK. Getting the bloody wheels to actually fit without fouling is tougher... and you will also come very close to breaching some of the modified vehicle guidelines with respect to offset change (at least in NSW). The thread below gives some ideas on this:
http://www.fbekholden.com/forum/viewtop ... modore+26P

Agree with Trev and Mick - the HR front and rear is a lot less drama (though fewer donor cars around than the Conformadore).

Cheers,
Harv

[Coopa]

Hi Harv,
Just read the link and I also found another post that Trev was on discussing the HR rear end, at the moment I'm leaning more towards a HR disc front, HR rear with a red six (173 or 186), chassis strengthing kit & 14" steel wheels with GM caps.

Classic look

What would be your thoughts on the different front end options V6 Conversions, Castekmaine Rod Shop or Original HR front end.

Cheers Coops

[Rusty EK]

Here is a front end , getting hard to find now
http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/mathinna ... 1007391988

[Coopa]

haha thanks rusty I was just looking at that theres also a guy in hobart with a HR disc diff and a few other bits.

I'll make a quick call to a local engineer tomorrow and ask a fee questions, have a good look and take a few measurements on the old grey over the next few days and make a decision before I get to far in.

Top of drivers pillar rust removed and new sections welded in tonight only 8 more rust patches to go before sandblasting.

She's on her way

[Blacky]

I was starting from scratch these days I would use a Torana front end , especially if going V6 or V8 . If I had to choose between CRS and V6 Conversions front ends it would be V6 conversions first , daylight second and CRS front end third.

[Coopa]

Hi Blacky,
I'm assuming that you mean LH/LH front end? whats involved if I can find an original Ranna front?