Seat belts

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Seat belts

Post by FB search »

I tried to follow HYPORX's (from Ozrod site) advice re google (see pic
below) but alas I find I am playing detective without getting a straight
answer. So, I know almost all of you will know the answer to my query.

Did FBs (or EKs for that matter) come out with seat belts?

I'm guessing NO due to the many posts regarding putting them in and
a trawl of FB specs both in shop manual and the World Wide Wait that
yielded no mention of them.

So... can someone educate me please ?

I'm gonna take a stab at the first holden to come out with seat belts was
the HR because I read about a publicity stunt for HR seat belts that went
wrong. I think they were trying to show new ways to double park using
seat belts or something like that (maybe not).
sigh... when will I learn... leave the funny stuff to the people who r funny... :roll:

Cheers
Dominic
Image
The search continues...
smooth

Post by smooth »

Seat Belts were a NASCO option, so the answer is yes they came out with them "if" you ordered them. The first model to have them as standard equipment was the HD Series and the EJ "Premier" before that.

The seat belts were of the lift flap design as seen in my advertisement for seat belt decals and art work.

Image

Image

Regards, Smooth 8)
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ahhhh.... i c

Post by FB search »

Thanks Smooth,

You are a regular font of knowledge :)

I ask becasue I can't see much evidence on that Blue FB on Ebay (in perth) that's on at the moment. I've sent them an email but I haven't heard back yet.

It's just what I've been waiting for but I was expecting seat belts.

Looks great though.

Cheers
Dominic
The search continues...
Dr Terry
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Joined: Sat May 21, 2005 6:41 pm
State: NSW
Location: Eastwood

Post by Dr Terry »

Hi Guys.

Smooth said:- "Seat Belts were a NASCO option, so the answer is yes they came out with them "if" you ordered them. The first model to have them as standard equipment was the HD Series and the EJ "Premier" before that. "

This is a common myth. The first factory-fitted seatbelts were not fitted as standard equipment until 1st Sept 1966, as part of the HR 'safety upgrade'. From then onwards they were fitted as standard equipment to all models from the basic ute to a fully-loaded Premier. They were however available as a factory-fitted option (PO no. 552) from the beginning of the HD series. I have this on paper, but have never sighted any in the flesh. There were no factory-fitted seatbelts available prior to the HD series. All EJ & EH series had the threaded anchorage points in the floor (but not in the B-pillar), for the 2 front passenger positions, to enable the fitting of aftermarket or dealer-fitted Nasco accessory seatbelt kits. Prior to the EJ series (or for any rear belts) the floor had to be drilled and reinforcing plates (incuded in the kits) fitted to the other side of the panel. The Nasco universal kits came out in the early 60s & could be fitted to just about any car, not just Holdens. Many early kits were lap-type belts only, but lap-sash was also available, but the B-pillar had to be drilled right through, in some cases leaving a fairly ugly bolt-head visible on the outside of the pillar.

To complicate this, during the 70s, the NSW RTA made it compulsory to fit 2 front passenger seatbelts to all cars manufactured on or after 1st January 1965, even though they were not factory standard in the first place. This is why you hardly ever see HDs without seatbelts of some type fitted.

Dr Terry.
smooth

Post by smooth »

Terry,

Mate, I accept some of what you say but it is not a myth mate. I have early NASCO HOLDEN film and television ads showing clearly and even promoting the NASCO seat belts fitted to EJ and EH Holden's this was released well before the HD or the HR with compulsory fitted factory belts.

The first time "factory" entered this thread was by you!

Whatever the case, whether done at the GMH factory or done at a GMH dealer NASCO belts have been available since the FB Holden and even possibly before that in other brands. But these I do not acknowledge as Holden.

I understand you have put a lot of time into your research (I have also) so if you have a different opinion/conclusion fair enough, but don't "Quote" me as spreading a myth. There is no myth about it. NASCO is what I specialise in and my genuine Holden documentation clearly shows Genuine Holden NASCO belts available long before the HD and Holden's promotional safety upgrade ads for the HR (quick we better clean up our act over the HD flop). It matters not if anchorage points were fitted standard or plates were part of the kit. They both are fitted Holden seat belts.

Take a look at this old earlyholdens newsletter There is a flash movie at the bottom right promoting NASCO in an EH seat beats and all. Also the image above is from 1961 promoting NASCO seat belts and why you as the dealer should be fitting them for your customers safety. Use only genuine NASCO parts "The ONLY one's Approved by General Motors Holden's"

Regards, Smooth 8)
Dr Terry
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State: NSW
Location: Eastwood

Post by Dr Terry »

Hi Smooth.

I apologise if I sounded a bit harsh, that was not my intent. My ‘myth’ comment wasn’t directed at you personally. I realise your knowledge of old Holdens & NASCO in particular, is quite extensive. By ‘myth’, I was referring to the comment:-

“The first model to have them as standard equipment was the HD Series and the EJ "Premier" before that.”

The way I interpret the phrase ‘standard equipment’ is that GM-H supplied & fitted that particular item to that particular model at the factory & it was included in the recommended retail price. e.g. a Hydra-Matic and leather trimmed bucket seats were ‘standard equipment’ on an EJ Premier. Or, windscreen washers were standard equipment on an HD Premier, but not on an HD Special. However the washers were available as both a factory option & a dealer-fitted NASCO accessory on the HD Special.

I know that GM-H dealers were selling (& fitting) Genuine NASCO seatbelt kits since 1961, but this doesn’t make them standard equipment until they are actually fitted by GM-H on the assembly line as price inclusive equipment for that model. As I said, I have no knowledge of (or documentation for) this occurring, even as an extra-cost option, prior to the HD series. Dealer-fitted Genuine NASCO – YES. Factory-fitted genuine with an option number – NO.

You’ve answered Dominic’s original question well. He simply asked, “Did FBs (or EKs for that matter) come out with seat belts? “
All I was clearing up was what he meant by the term ‘come out’. Did he mean ‘from the factory’ or ‘as delivered by the dealer’ (after the dealer had fitted the accessories that the customer had ordered when he ordered the car in the first place).

By the way, 'the HD a flop !' Holden's biggest selling months, ever, were in mid-1965 in terms of gross sales. It's the newer 'trendy' motoring journalists that have deemed the HD to be 'a flop' retrospectively. These guys weren't motoring journalists in 1965. The HD series was considered to be a modern and spacious design in 1965 & sold very well. Yes, many commented on the pointy guards, but that didn't stop them from selling in bucket loads. These were the years that &*#@, Chrysler & the Japs were just starting to get serious and GM-H still owned well over 40% of the market.

Life is too short to get into a silly argument, after all, we all share the same passion, our old Holdens !.

Dr Terry
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after market fitting today

Post by FB search »

Hi there folks,

Thank you so much for the very informative discussion. I don't see it as an argument simply a healthy discussion and I am richer for the posts you've made. :D

I am very interested in acquiring an FB sedan that has been restored with no seat belts front or back as they were not fitted by the dealer when new. (notice my new found confidence in talking about the fitting :wink: )

So what to do? Before I make my offer, I need to figure into my budget fitting seat belts.

Smooth, Do you deal with whole seat belts?

Can anyone give me a rough estimate for the bits I would need to install 6 seat belts? I think I would like to put in retractables where possible. In the meantime I will see what I can gather via internet research.

Kind regards
Dominic
The search continues...
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prices

Post by FB search »

Looks like I might be able to answer my own question here.

It seems about $100 - $115 seems to be the price for retractable seat belts from Hemco.

Any time saving knowledge would be greatly appreciated :)

Kind regards
Dominic
The search continues...
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